A Pro Stock engine builder may prefer a wide LSA to help keep the power from breaking traction tOo early. Do you like to go fast? If all the specs remained the same what will going from a 110 to a 112 lsa do to driving characteristics? It provides a spark plug with the high voltage needed for combustion. This causes the engine's street manners and tuning to become fickle. - Sheryl Crow. Well get out of that stocker and build a hipo motor for your VW. OK, what is hydraboost, and how do you like how the cam performs??? But, the internal processings are much more complicated. 292S-112: 292/292 - 240/240 - .495/.495 - 112* - 3400-7200. Moreover, a user from the Chevelle forum said. Post Well, If I am not mistaken, you must be looking for which angle has what impact on your engine or which would be the best. Brul spun the engine over with the dyno's starters and recorded 185 psi of cranking compression. somthing to that aspect. I think the compression ratio has something to do with LSA too. Chuck Lawrence of Jon Kaase Racing Engines was asked to give a 520ci BBF a Pro Stock sound, so he went with a 108 LSA in place of a more conventional 112 LSA. Frankly cams with a 108-114 lca unless in the perfect combo you won't usually see more than 15hp and you won't really feel the difference except for either a peaky or broad power band. I am pretty sure, right now, you find yourself in the middle of the rising debate of 106 vs 110 lobe separation angle. by lazaris Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:18 pm, Post Equipped with the 120-degree (LSA) cam, the hybrid stroker produced 570 hp at 6,200 rpm and 535 lb-ft of torque at 5,200 rpm. Adding an aftermarket cam to an otherwise stock engine can boost output by 40-60 hp (or more) with no other changes (except possibly a valvespring upgrade). But it also has a lot of lobe separation. Cam Advise - 332-428 Ford FE Engine Forum Check out the Comp Cams catalog, even the biggest hydraulic rollers use 110. Its the shifting problem again with your Chevy! It should still make close to 600hp and 600tq in my 512" stealth headed big block. It is an important note you must keep; due to the lobe separation angle, there creates an overlapping of intake valve opening time and exhaust valve closing time and vice versa. kinda off topic.. but while we're on the topic of cams, duration,lift,ect has anybody heard of using high compreshion (13:1) on pump gas, by useing alot of duration? Supercharged and nitrous race engines typically benefit from a wider LSA because they dont require as much overlap for exhaust scavenging as does the naturally aspirated engine, continues Bolander. 110 LSA: However, if you look at the rate of cranking compression at 110 LSA, you will find a reduced compression rate from the standard cranking compression PSI level. The other thing is that you can make more power with a smaller aftermarket cam. 106 Vs 110 Lobe Separation Angle: Real Impacts You Must Learn The 114 cam will give more low end torque, good midrange, less power up high. Meaning the lower lobe seperation will have a very quick and fast powerband (Snappy!) Engine builders Chuck Lawrence, left, and Doug Patton. Also If you go with 112 lobe centers, you create less valve overlap which will increase your compretion. 106 LSA: There is an increasing chance of engine knock at the 106 lobe separation angle. 108 vs. 110 lobe separation angle?? - Vintage Mustang Forums I will be running an Edelbrock Performer RPM, with a Quick Fuel 750cfm with a screw adjustable vacuum secondary; it's called the Pro-vac. It is the DESIGNED events that yield CENTERLINE. Build your own custom newsletter with the content you love from EngineLabs, directly to your inbox, absolutely FREE! In my opinion, the rougher the idle the better! When choosing a cam, power gains shouldn't be the only consideration. If you take any of the . 112 will have a smoother idle, a wider power band, and will work better with fuel injection. The 114 LSA is good for a blower or nitros motor. Required fields are marked *. That was all, and we have already reached the concluding point. 110 LSA: On the other hand, 110 LSA is a wider LSA with almost no overlap. The lobe separation angle is the angle in camshaft degrees between the maximum lift points, or centerlines, of the intake and exhaust lobes. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Effect Of Changes In Cam Timing And Lobe Separation Angle - COMP Cams I've seen a few comments in threads on here that have said things like "going to the 112LC from the 108LC gives 4lbft more torque at the bottom and 2bhp more at the top" yet this would seem to go against what webcam say on. Icao Annex 10 Aeronauticaltelecommunicationsvolumeiv-Surveillanc The idle quality was better with the 112-degree LSA but not as good as the wider 120-degree cam.The ultra-wide 120-degree LSA lost low-speed power and never recovered, but know that this wide LSA is often beneficial on positive displacement, supercharged applications. You are using an out of date browser. The engine will have weak performance in the low-end range.A low vacuum can also cause the brake pedal to be quite difficult to press. The 112-degree cam (red lines) picked up much of the torque, but the big winner was the cam with the tightest lobe separation angle. 108 Lobe Separation These are my motors specs 1979 - 347 Stroker 10:1 Compression Holley 670 Street Avenger or a Holley 650 (I have both) Roush 200 Cylinder Heads (minor head work) 1.6 Roller Rockers Shorty BBK Headers 373 Rear End 5 Speed Transmission Cross Gap Intake (Power Band 1500-6500) FlowMaster Dual Exhaust (of course no Cats) MSD 6Al lobe centers and lobe separation are 2 different things . The only reason I . It will also give you a smoother idle and probably even better gas mileage. Tests have shown that, for a given cam profile, a tighter (smaller) lobe center will produce more average horsepower and a quicker revving engine. The graph above compares intake valve closing points of the three cams used in the test. But that doesnt mean high-strung racing engines cant see gains, as well. 106 LSA: As you know, the intake and exhaust lobes centerline distance is known as lobe separation angle. We even treated them to some chamber work before installation. A cams Lobe center angle equals intake centerline plus exhaust . We borrowed Westech Performance's shop mule, a 370ci small-block Chevy and its SuperFlow 902 engine dyno and spent a day running each cam back-to-back to gauge its effect on peak horsepower, peak torque, cranking compression, idle vacuum, and the powerband as a wholeall the variables that define an engine's character on the street and track. Thats just the way the customer wants to roll, and engine builders find its easy to deliver such a powerplant. We do not stock profiles with 109 or 114 lobe centers. The 108-degree cam (blue lines) outperformed the other two, but idle quality suffered. Going from a 110 to 112 lobe separtaion - Ford Muscle Cars Tech Forum 106 LSA: At 106 LSA, the cylinder pressure is a bit higher. See all 14 photos 13 The three power curves indicate that the wide (120-degree). 554"/577" lift. LSA is a result of valve timing events. Because during the lower units oil change, you can go through the issue that the lower plug, Read More Yamaha Lower Unit Drain Plug Size [Explained Everything]Continue, Among the crucial parts of a vehicle ignition system is the ignition coil, also called a spark coil. The engine has AFR heads, Crane rockers, a TCI balancer, a Scat Rotating assembly with Mahle pistons, an Edelbrock RPM Air-Gap intake, an MSD ignition, and an Aeromotive fuel system. 114LSA +4 puts the intake centerline at 110 degrees before top dead center. Average power was also down, but the engine pulled ahead of the 101 cam at 5,400 rpm, picking up 6.5 hp at peak. The 110 is probably a better choice for a performance street engine. 238/248 duration, 300/310 adv. VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. Do you know what the best lobe separation angle for your car engine is? 110 for sure. Valve lift will bear weight in any decision regarding LSA. I don't know about 13 to one but I have seen 12 to one on a 350 chev in hot rod article, BUT the guy soft petals around on the street with no full throttle use and puts racing gas in at the track. That way you can discuss what you want from the engine and how changes in LSA or any of the other specs will affect how the engine performs. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Disclaimer: Remember to always consult with an expert first before trying anything at home. Fixing the ignition coils is essential when you experience issues like engine misfire and the Check Engine light that wont go off. Another related thought to consider when selecting a cam is inches of vacuum for your engine application when deciding upon a Lobe Center. Comp cam hydraulic roller lifters. 106 LSA: 106LSA results in a decrease in piston-to-valve clearance. This is why the LS series, and many other modern engines, can make great power on top and bottom with wide LSA camshafts and why a plethora of factory cylinder heads are flowing near (or above) 300 cfm. or just enough to keep the neighbors pissed? After the next three pulls, it was clear the 113 cam was way down on low-end torque. JavaScript is disabled. The article was called "Separation of Power" and they tested 5 cams ranged from 106 to 114 LSA. This may be of concern if you have vacuum assisted accessories, such as power brakes or steering. Full text of "Pediatric Books" But it is a piece of good news for your engine. Howards Cam Vs Comp Cam: Which Is The Best Option For You? The 110 is probably a better choice for a performance street engine. by flat4racer17 Mon May 12, 2003 1:40 pm, Post Howards Cams Retro-Fit Hydraulic Roller Camshaft and Lifter Kits CL120325-08. That is why 106 LSA consumes less oil. Anybody do any real testing on LSA in a 3.75 stroke small block chevy?I have always used 104-106 and was thinking about trying a 108 or 110 design.I know there is a lot of variables but just a general opinion from any experts.This is for motor only no nitrous.600-640 HP engine combos.Much appreciated! That means your engine can produce more power with a minimum amount of fuel combustion. Lobe separations on 383-406 cids.104-106-108-110? - Don Terrill's Speed by Kdub Sun Dec 07, 2008 1:20 am, Post "It's not having what you want, it's wanting what you've got!" Walter Noah is a process engineer who has a knack for resolving even the toughest technical issue. The Crane has a smoother idle, broader power band, and . So, without wasting any moment, lets find out the answer. Camshaft Lobe Separation Angle | Classic Car Restoration Club I have Crane hydraulic link bar style roller lifters, so I dont have to use the spider style. 106 LSA: You can see an increasing EGR effect at 106 LSA. Due to the tightness and frequent overlapping of the intake and exhaust valves, the engine cant generate the high RPM as it is supposed to. Let's just talk lobe sep angle. Chevy Transmission Wont Shift Into 3rd: Finding the Main Culprit, Yamaha Lower Unit Drain Plug Size [Explained Everything], Does It Matter Which Ignition Coil Goes Where? I do believe that stock VW seperation is 108 and 112 is used alot in turbo and midrange cams for VW's while 106 is used for the top end cams. Pontiac 326 Vs Chevy 327 Differences & Similarities. The 108-degree cam offered both the most power and torque, but idle quality suffered compared to the wider LSAs. How do the lobe separations change when you factor in turbocharging? I though my car would have a nice rough idle with the solid cam with a tight LSA I put in my car, its go a slight lope to it, but it pulls hard. Also, the wider LSA contributes to chassis stability in drag racing by avoiding the delivery of a ferocious blast of power that would break tire traction. 110 LSA: On the contrary, it is pretty unpleasant to inform you that the efficient compression rate decreases at 110 LSA. If you look at any given cam catalog, you will find that the majority of street-oriented cams fall in this range. Big strokers like tighter LCA but it really depends on your combo and usage, theres great OTS cams but for a custom engine a custom cam is the way to go With identical cam lobes you won't see a bit of difference. Tight LSA cams make excellent low-end torque and have a beautiful power curve. A cam with a 112 lobe center will idle smoother than a cam with a 110 lobe center. Lobe separations gives lots of overlap and lobe centers just happens when the grinder decides how the peak of the lobe will arrive on a specific grind by their tooling. ~These are just some of the drawbacks weas guys who like to go mach 10 with our hair on fire and these little motors screaming at rpms that make other guys cryhave to deal with.~. The tighter the lobe center, the lower the RPM range; the wider the lobe center, the higher the RPM range. Overlap is the amount of time that both valves are open in the same cylinder. Usually, this separation angle ranges from 95-degree to 120-degree. Lobe seperation cant be seperated from duration,the 2 are connected.the old duntov cam had a lot less duration than many new cams so the valve overlap was not extreme and the engine ran with a gentle lope.Increase the duration by 20* and this cam would shake a 283 out of the car at idle,but then increase the lobe seperation by 4* and the motor will have a gentle lope again. A narrower lobe separation angle can provide less power but can also lead to less wear. by Paul H Tue May 13, 2003 1:24 pm, Post The intake lobe centerline is measured in crankshaft degrees. I'm surprized at these questions as well as some of the replies. " I've seen that Webcam cams can be ordered with either of the above. http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220, http://www.popularhotrodding.com/en6em_camshaft_specs/lobe_seperation_angle.html. Either learn to fix it, or learn to write checks. But an interestingly shocking fact is that this event escalates the air-fuel mixtures reaction rates, causing temperatures to rise and causing the problem of overheating the engine. While a cam with a 108 lobe center will idle rougher. Yeah but do the experiment on the dyno and tell me your intuition is correct. such as 290 @.050? I've seen a few comments in threads on here that have said things like "going to the 112LC from the 108LC gives 4lbft more torque at the bottom and 2bhp more at the top" yet this would seem to go against what webcam say on. Simply put, both 106 and 110 lobe separation angles have many advantages and disadvantages. Increased Effective Connectivity of the Left Parietal Lobe During ( 2 ) Estimated Ship Date: Feb 23, 2023 (if ordered today) Drop Ship. Whatever you do, stay under 270 advertised duration and shoot for a 110 lobe separation. When degreeing in the camshaft, you are making sure the intake centerline is precisely where the cam is intended to be. Cylinder-head flow and LSA are directly related: as a rule of thumb, the better the head flows, the wider the LSA can be.